[ Closed ] X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++) (Page 4 of 19)

**captbullett** · 2016-06-04 16:04:56

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

laohu314 wrote:

ThommiTechnik wrote:
captbullett wrote:
Good day,
Yes, some of these questions I can't answer but yes I do know about being vectored and a need for the operation in the flight plan this could help resolve some of the issues maybe or maybe not only a real pilot can give the answer.
And right now I do not think you are vectored except on a GA for a missed approached on the Flight plan side of X-Life, now on the flight plan side of the aircraft you should be able to program in a vector where you want to on the aircraft you are talking about you just put the way points into the flight plan and the MCDU...
Happy flying,
Brian
Hi Brian,
thanks for your feedback. But I guess, you didn't get the point, I was talking of, could it be? The A330, A320, A340, I'm sitting in has a MCDU and FMC and FMGS, which our Dispatchers are feeding every day. And we in the cockpit are doing some correctements. But, as you maybe know, there was a time before all this GPS-things. And that happened in the 727 and 737-200 (as I remember this not really an GA But still flying for NASA (727), and some state-machines (727, 732). Maybe you know them better than me, and can show me, how to feed in a plane with VOR and no GPS, no FMC, no MCDU, how to insert in the Heading the SIDs and STARs Only thing would be CIVA. But better for you, to take place in the Jumpseat on a real plane, and watch an approach on KLAX, KDFW, KJFK,... . Then talk to me again, if the PF was flying the complete STAR, or if he was suddenly vectored, because of traffic, shortcuts, weather, and so on.
There's a huge difference between gaming and simming and real-life.
Cheers
Thomas

Clearly, vectoring from ATC would be ideal and most realistic. Pilots I talked to say that they practically never fly a complete route for the exact reasons Thomas pointed out. However, I am not sure that currently an AI ATC is able to do that correctly without frying our systems, or even to pick the correct STAR in some cases. Therefore, I suggested to go back from AI to HI and use our own heads to choose the correct STAR in case the AI fails to do so. Also, I believe that poses a smaller programming challenge but maybe @JAR can weigh in here as well.
PS: I think Brian meant GA = "Go Around" and not "General Aircraft"...

Good day,

I am thinking not the IA aircraft but the aircraft that we are flying have this capability for this maneuver it really does not make sense to have the IA aircraft do this since, the IA aircraft have code written behind the Flight path they already fly, meaning they fly a set path for any given simulation I would say using the xml file.

Where as, the aircraft we fly can be made to fly the flight plan the we the pilot want to fly and therefore, we can be vectored out to a point and brought back to land.

Now, we need real pilot input for this to be set-up right no other way around it.

Thank-you for the input and

Happy flying,

captbullett

**ThommiTechnik** · 2016-06-04 16:13:07

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

laohu314 wrote:

Clearly, vectoring from ATC would be ideal and most realistic. Pilots I talked to say that they practically never fly a complete route for the exact reasons Thomas pointed out. However, I am not sure that currently an AI ATC is able to do that correctly without frying our systems, or even to pick the correct STAR in some cases. Therefore, I suggested to go back from AI to HI and use our own heads to choose the correct STAR in case the AI fails to do so. Also, I believe that poses a smaller programming challenge but maybe @JAR can weigh in here as well.
PS: I think Brian meant GA = "Go Around" and not "General Aircraft"...

Hi,

thanks for feedback. Yes, HI is everytime a good choice And yes, you're right. When "sitting in" the 727, I'm doing it on charts from LIDO. The meaning is: it would be fun, to hear ATC acting on vectors. And as I am no software-engineer, I can imagine, that it is not easy to program and handle this.

Cheers
Thomas

**ThommiTechnik** · 2016-06-04 16:14:37

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

captbullett wrote:

Now, we need real pilot input for this to be set-up right no other way around it.
Thank-you for the input and
Happy flying,
captbullett

Hi,

thanks for your feedback. If I can help in some way. let me know. I'm not a software-engineer, these times are gone, when there was Pascal and C++. Loooooooong time ago. Only thing I can do, is giving tips, experience.

Cheers
Thomas

**ilankrt** · 2016-06-04 16:25:30

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Test flight KSFO - KPDX , A320neo v.2.4r2, XL v.1.2b1, iMac27

KSFO
1. I thought to get red of it, but X-Plane ATC comes steady up while contacting XL ATIS, DELIVERY and GROUND ! On radio I recognized that every time I clicked on them, the radio channel changes to 118..... That is surly an XL bug.

2 Before take-off, 2 AI aircraft run over my airliner

3 CENTER advice for STAR was wrong... (Had enough time to correct it during flight)

Note:
At this stage I think it makes no sense to discuss about getting vectors. More importent now is to get correct advices for SID and STAR and FL for descending.

**captbullett** · 2016-06-04 17:10:01

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Good day,
MisterX6 KBOS is at the org
B.

**ThommiTechnik** · 2016-06-04 17:20:31

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

ilankrt wrote:

Note:
At this stage I think it makes no sense to discuss about getting vectors. More importent now is to get correct advices for SID and STAR and FL for descending.

SID and STAR needs vectoring - otherwise it's a video game, not a Sim. Take a look at charts, how often you'll find "expect vectors", especially in the US. Or listen to ATC of PANC, LSZH, VRMM,...

I'm not complaining, don't get me wrong. Just to want make it more real than a game....

Cheers,
Thomas

**captbullett** · 2016-06-04 17:29:05

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

ThommiTechnik wrote:

ilankrt wrote:
Note:
At this stage I think it makes no sense to discuss about getting vectors. More importent now is to get correct advices for SID and STAR and FL for descending.
SID and STAR needs vectoring - otherwise it's a video game, not a Sim. Take a look at charts, how often you'll find "expect vectors", especially in the US. Or listen to ATC of PANC, LSZH, VRMM,...
I'm not complaining, don't get me wrong. Just to want make it more real than a game....
Cheers,
Thomas

Thank-You OH is not vectoring how you pick up your starting point to run you cycle for ark on the STAR or even the DME on a radio approach ?
B.

**captbullett** · 2016-06-04 17:30:20

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

ilankrt wrote:

Test flight KSFO - KPDX , A320neo v.2.4r2, XL v.1.2b1, iMac27
KSFO
1. I thought to get red of it, but X-Plane ATC comes steady up while contacting XL ATIS, DELIVERY and GROUND ! On radio I recognized that every time I clicked on them, the radio channel changes to 118..... That is surly an XL bug.
2 Before take-off, 2 AI aircraft run over my airliner
3 CENTER advice for STAR was wrong... (Had enough time to correct it during flight)
Note:
At this stage I think it makes no sense to discuss about getting vectors. More importent now is to get correct advices for SID and STAR and FL for descending.

If 'bug' where is log txt ? for tracking?
B

**ivota** · 2016-06-04 18:07:23

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Hello mates.

Here is my suggestion:

Read ATIS
1. When request clearance , ATC give us ( JAR123, check information ALFA (or B,C,E...) , then we check ATIS in X-Life window, then we confirm "Information ALFA (or B,C,E...) on board".
Also on arrival when contact Approch, ATC give us ( JAR123, check information INDIA), then we check ATIS windows in X-Life)
we confirm ATIS ("Information INDIA check").

Contact ATC CENTER
2. After passing FL100 or better if x-life can read Transition FL when Climb should contact ATC Center.
When reach final FL show report TOD in X-Life window.

Others
is possible that ATC do correction if we :
-don't respond for last transmition
ex. ATC=JAR123 Clear to land , I don't (forget) push button to confirm Clear to land
so ATC should ask again

- final FL is 350, but we climb to FL340 and continue flying
ATC should ask us to climb to final FL350
- final FL is 350, but we climb to FL380 and continue flying
ATC should ask us to descent to FL350

for now is enough.
Just my two cents.
JAR if you have a time, also if you accept these suggestion.
Best regards

**captbullett** · 2016-06-04 18:37:57

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

ivota wrote:

Hello mates.
Here is my suggestion:
Read ATIS
1. When request clearance , ATC give us ( JAR123, check information ALFA (or B,C,E...) , then we check ATIS in X-Life window, then we confirm "Information ALFA (or B,C,E...) on board".
Also on arrival when contact Approch, ATC give us ( JAR123, check information INDIA), then we check ATIS windows in X-Life)
we confirm ATIS ("Information INDIA check").
Contact ATC CENTER
2. After passing FL100 or better if x-life can read Transition FL when Climb should contact ATC Center.
When reach final FL show report TOD in X-Life window.
Others
is possible that ATC do correction if we :
-don't respond for last transmition
ex. ATC=JAR123 Clear to land , I don't (forget) push button to confirm Clear to land
so ATC should ask again
- final FL is 350, but we climb to FL340 and continue flying
ATC should ask us to climb to final FL350

for now is enough.
Just my two cents.
JAR if you have a time, also if you accept these suggestion.
Best regards

- final FL is 350, but we climb to FL380 and continue flying
ATC should ask us to descent to FL350

Good day,

Yes, spot on then you factor in the Nav data errors (like mis match data in Navigraph charts we go by and the actual data we fly by in MCDU) and cycle data and this is what we are trying to figure out how to work it into a do able simulation. and like a real pilot tell me sometime life is like a box of chocolate you don't know what you will get. so that is what I like about X-Life and the challenge of the X-Plane world it is a challenge and you have to think!

great post.
B.

Ps, one quick fix is to go the map 'Location' dropdown list... and check the box at the top of the map ... 'shutdown tailwind ILSs' and this will give you a different set-up, now I did not say this is a fix but report back and tell me what you get.

**laohu314** · 2016-06-04 18:44:07

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

captbullett wrote:

Good day,
MisterX6 KBOS is at the org
B.

Wow, thanks Brian!
I was waiting for this on the edge of my seat...

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**captbullett** · 2016-06-04 18:48:04

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

laohu314 wrote:

captbullett wrote:
Good day,
MisterX6 KBOS is at the org
B.
Wow, thanks Brian!
I was waiting for this on the edge of my seat...

Yes I figured a lot of the regulars would like to know and it works with XL...
B

**ilankrt** · 2016-06-04 19:00:40

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

ThommiTechnik wrote:

ilankrt wrote:
Note:
At this stage I think it makes no sense to discuss about getting vectors. More importent now is to get correct advices for SID and STAR and FL for descending.
SID and STAR needs vectoring - otherwise it's a video game, not a Sim. Take a look at charts, how often you'll find "expect vectors", especially in the US. Or listen to ATC of PANC, LSZH, VRMM,...
I'm not complaining, don't get me wrong. Just to want make it more real than a game....
Cheers,
Thomas

Hi Thomas

Believe me, I know how it is to fly simulation with given vectors, as I used to fly also under VATSIM with live control.
But think how complicated it must be to program them on AI level. You have to take in account weather (sight and wind), appropriate speed (for every aircraft model), air traffic nearby (all needed parameter of every AI aircraft), RWY landing and take-off frequencies and so on... . Real and VATSIM controller are sitting before a radar screens using a powerful air traffic management software reacting to corresponding variable situation (like permanent change of weather conditions, burst winds, emergency situations etc.)

Question is how to manage such a complex situation in XL?
and if you want to reduce parameters, how to do this work?
A model that gives you perpetual vectors for every specific approach is uninterestingly and far away from the near real thing.

I would like to get a more and more sophisticated AI ATC in XL, but I have not the illusion that it can be done in only few leaps.
On the other side any concrete idea can help to get forward....

**captbullett** · 2016-06-04 19:17:14

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

ilankrt wrote:

ThommiTechnik wrote:
ilankrt wrote:
Note:
At this stage I think it makes no sense to discuss about getting vectors. More importent now is to get correct advices for SID and STAR and FL for descending.
SID and STAR needs vectoring - otherwise it's a video game, not a Sim. Take a look at charts, how often you'll find "expect vectors", especially in the US. Or listen to ATC of PANC, LSZH, VRMM,...
I'm not complaining, don't get me wrong. Just to want make it more real than a game....
Cheers,
Thomas
Hi Thomas
Believe me, I know how it is to fly simulation with given vectors, as I used to fly also under VATSIM with live control.
But think how complicated it must be to program them on AI level. You have to take in account weather (sight and wind), appropriate speed (for every aircraft model), air traffic nearby (all needed parameter of every AI aircraft), RWY landing and take-off frequencies and so on... . Real and VATSIM controller are sitting before a radar screens using a powerful air traffic management software reacting to corresponding variable situation (like permanent change of weather conditions, burst winds, emergency situations etc.)
Question is how to manage such a complex situation in XL?
and if you want to reduce parameters, how to do this work?
A model that gives you perpetual vectors for every specific approach is uninterestingly and far away from the near real thing.
I would like to get a more and more sophisticated AI ATC in XL, but I have not the illusion that it can be done in only few leaps.
On the other side any concrete idea can help to get forward....

Good day,

I know that code for AI is already in the xml and txt placement files so to vector the AI is not the issue, it's the code behind the MCDU that need to be written that is the hard part since you have to write it for each and every SID and STAR if it were to be a vector set-up , now I could be wrong but we can ask JAR.

Brian

**captbullett** · 2016-06-04 20:49:02

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

good day,

Ps, one quick fix is to go the map 'Location' dropdown list... and check the box at the top of the map ... 'shutdown tailwind ILSs' and this will give you a different set-up, now I did not say this is a fix but report back and tell me what you get.

captbullett

**Sloboda** · 2016-06-05 07:56:58

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Hello,
i don't understand something...
Before, when i request clearance, ATC gives me the SID.
Now, he just say me " via departure".
Is it normal ?

Thank you.

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**Sloboda** · 2016-06-05 07:59:23

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Hello,
is it possible to put the X-Life Traffic volume down ?

Thanks

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**ThommiTechnik** · 2016-06-05 08:12:53

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

captbullett wrote:

Thank-You OH is not vectoring how you pick up your starting point to run you cycle for ark on the STAR or even the DME on a radio approach ?
B.

I'm sorry, but I don't understand, what you mean?

**captbullett** · 2016-06-05 16:06:29

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

ThommiTechnik wrote:

captbullett wrote:
Thank-You OH is not vectoring how you pick up your starting point to run you cycle for ark on the STAR or even the DME on a radio approach ?
B.
I'm sorry, but I don't understand, what you mean?

Good day,
Do, you have to vector to run an arc for, the VOR navigation is, what I was trying to say ... when you run the arc do you need to vector to start the run of a radial ?

http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/vor-nav.htm

Brian

Ps, for those that want to do a VOR approach there is a downloadable file here and instruction on how to do the approach.

http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/vor-appr.htm

**captbullett** · 2016-06-05 16:20:11

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Sloboda wrote:

Hello,
is it possible to put the X-Life Traffic volume down ?
Thanks

God day,
Yes, I do not know what version you have, if you have the deluxe version then the gear on the pop-up menu you will see two sliders
for volume just adjust them to, your liking.

Happy Flying,

Brian

**laohu314** · 2016-06-05 20:07:40

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

captbullett wrote:

ThommiTechnik wrote:
captbullett wrote:
Thank-You OH is not vectoring how you pick up your starting point to run you cycle for ark on the STAR or even the DME on a radio approach ?
B.
I'm sorry, but I don't understand, what you mean?
Good day,
Do, you have to vector to run an arc for, the VOR navigation is, what I was trying to say ... when you run the arc do you need to vector to start the run of a radial ?
http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/vor-nav.htm
Brian
Ps, for those that want to do a VOR approach there is a downloadable file here and instruction on how to do the approach.
http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/vor-appr.htm

Thank you Brian!

Very useful and needed, for me, at least.

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**captbullett** · 2016-06-06 01:15:52

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Good day,
Yes the testing is on going,
as KSAN/KAVX and the Cathy DC-3 run to the island but a CTD so everything was working and it just took to long to get to the FL most likely the culprit for the CTD.

Brian

Post's attachments

XL CTD using a DC-3 .txt 60.55 kb, 314 downloads since 2016-06-05

Cycle Dump.txt 47.93 kb, 297 downloads since 2016-06-05

Log.txt 55.75 kb, 322 downloads since 2016-06-05

**captbullett** · 2016-06-06 03:57:49

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Good day,
So,
A good test on a GA aircraft and the same airports used as before KSNA/KAVX and the change is in the aircraft that was used but the nav data was the same because I was using the stock GNS 403/530 difference is one I installed into the DC-3 and the other came stock in the aircraft.
This should not make a difference now that I have a good run on the one aircraft I will go back and try again and see if the sim will take to the data.

here is the log tet to match to the other aircraft to see if we can track down what it is

Post's attachments

Cycle Dump.txt 19.41 kb, 325 downloads since 2016-06-05

Log.txt 68.24 kb, 345 downloads since 2016-06-05

**Pepe** · 2016-06-06 06:06:01

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Hello friends,
A simple question....

Using X-live (demo version) I only can see two airplanes taxing and only one landing..... I´m using it in airports with fourth runaways and selecting frequency to 150 in the setting options.

Somebody can tell me what are I doing wrong?

Many thanks in advance.

**captbullett** · 2016-06-06 13:16:15

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Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

Pepe wrote:

Hello friends,
A simple question....
Using X-live (demo version) I only can see two airplanes taxing and only one landing..... I´m using it in airports with fourth runaways and selecting frequency to 150 in the setting options.
Somebody can tell me what are I doing wrong?
Many thanks in advance.

Good day,
Hi and welcome, if I understand you right you are trying to set the frq. for the runway ILS or is it the number of aircraft that will display.

So, if it is the number of aircraft that will display then each airport has it's own traffic flow. May I point to an airport like KATL or KMIA to see an airport with a lot of traffic to compare the traffic you are seeing now.

Nevertheless, for the future please do not be vague in the description on your first post and your answer will be faster to answer.
Give the airport IACO and maybe a log txt since we are a beta site and JAR tracks issues and this is what makes X-Life a good plugin to use weather you use the Demo version or the deluxe version.

Happy Flying,
Brian

[ Closed ] X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++) (Page 4 of 19)

Posts: 76 to 100 of 471

76 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-04 16:04:56 (edited by captbullett 2016-06-04 16:06:07)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

77 Reply by ThommiTechnik 2016-06-04 16:13:07

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

78 Reply by ThommiTechnik 2016-06-04 16:14:37

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

79 Reply by ilankrt 2016-06-04 16:25:30 (edited by ilankrt 2016-06-04 22:33:00)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

80 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-04 17:10:01

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

81 Reply by ThommiTechnik 2016-06-04 17:20:31

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

82 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-04 17:29:05 (edited by captbullett 2016-06-04 18:04:01)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

83 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-04 17:30:20

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

84 Reply by ivota 2016-06-04 18:07:23 (edited by ivota 2016-06-05 09:31:38)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

85 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-04 18:37:57 (edited by captbullett 2016-06-04 20:46:58)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

86 Reply by laohu314 2016-06-04 18:44:07

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

87 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-04 18:48:04

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

88 Reply by ilankrt 2016-06-04 19:00:40 (edited by ilankrt 2016-06-04 19:01:06)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

89 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-04 19:17:14 (edited by captbullett 2016-06-04 19:25:55)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

90 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-04 20:49:02

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

91 Reply by Sloboda 2016-06-05 07:56:58

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

92 Reply by Sloboda 2016-06-05 07:59:23

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

93 Reply by ThommiTechnik 2016-06-05 08:12:53

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

94 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-05 16:06:29 (edited by captbullett 2016-06-05 16:14:34)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

95 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-05 16:20:11

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

96 Reply by laohu314 2016-06-05 20:07:40

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

97 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-06 01:15:52 (edited by captbullett 2016-06-06 01:18:27)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

98 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-06 03:57:49 (edited by captbullett 2016-06-06 03:59:07)

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

99 Reply by Pepe 2016-06-06 06:06:01

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

100 Reply by captbullett 2016-06-06 13:16:15

Re: X-Life ver 1.1 (r1, ++)

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